(vBulletin courtesy Jelsoft Enterprises Limited. > Yes, this annoyed me a bit too. I know that from my own point of view I quickly went from feeling a bit liberated by the start of the Phase 1 thing to feeling a bit liberated but also a bit more anxious after last Saturday's events (and the more recent statements from the police, MS and SMR haven't alleviated that). Pretty sure the top car park is NTS, and possibly the upper section of road too. It is a different jurisdiction. At the moment all cases, except for custodies, are being put off. Like Sweden. https://www.stirling.gov.uk/news/2020/june-2020/road-closures-in-response-to-5-mile-flouters/. Members of the public are quite entitled to ignore it if they so decide. > I live in Edinburgh. While I can see the reason for it, I was personally disappointed there was not more of a loosening, but it is definitely a loosening. A lot of people are being very cagey (or totally silent) about what they're doing exercise-wise, and although I admire your openness and honesty I wouldn't want for a minute for it to lead you into proper trouble. The current situation appears to be changing the mountaineering world and not for the better. To save boring you any more, I'll back down to your knowledge on hills anytime,Dave, but I'm not backing down on this so we'll just have to agree to disagree. I felt really happy for him, and meeting him was undoubtedly the highlight of my day. Tough, but that's just the way it is. But my point is that the MR chair said his organisation would not judge in the event of a callout, yet less than a fortnight later he's "pleased to see the police taking action against such individuals". You put yourself in contact with the police and if you come in contact with the police when you are doing something illegal you can expect them to act like the police. He also says that a work colleague who plays Royal Troon "is abstaining so far - he says it has kind of split the club.". Yes, I think Dollar and Tilly both out of my "local" range. What has changed is the removal of the word 'need' from 8(4) in relation to exercise. The use of the words community, broadly and wheel are all vague and people will interpret them differently. However the Ochils on a sunny late-spring Sunday seemed an utterly sensible place for him to try and get back to doing what he clearly loved, and it was very obvious (we bumped into each other twice during the day) that getting out and starting to ease himself back in was doing wonders for his general wellbeing / mental health - aspects that are being woefully neglected in this current crisis. And what happens if they apply for a job in England or Wales - is this "criminal conviction" on their records here or not due to it being Scottish ? Arguing that the guidelines should be different is rather different from ignoring and advocating that people ignore the guidelines that we have. > Sign at road turn off at Logie Kirk this morning reminding people to keep their distance. The Dumyat/Cocksburn/Pendreich situation is pretty silly as it stands, and I can imagine that Lubnaig etc is similar - although you're into the Nat Park across there so that complicates things. Like you, I'm busy on the Ochils - but it now appears that the apparent increase in scope, even locally, that was introduced last Friday should be treated with considerable caution. Let's get it done and hope England does the same. I think it would have been better to have emphasised "local" but to have put an absolutely definite but more generous upper limit of, say, 15 miles. Makes sense though. With no limit on distance travelled? Happy to concede the point. There is no law in Scotland just now restricting travel for excerise, and I imagine Munro's have been climbed by thousands of people traveling more than 5 miles since lockdown was eased. The outcome of the report being sent to the PF is unknown. We are pleased to see the police taking action against such individuals.”, > “Mountain rescue teams are here to help. To list messages for just a single forum (e.g., Expedition & Alpine) click on a link at the side of this page.There are 86 users currently online.. Register as a New User to get your own User Profile, personal Photos Gallery and extras like only showing new messages and privacy features. Because that does appear to be feasible in the current situation, as I doubt very much that the "within the spirit of the guidelines" argument for either of us would wash with police or mountain rescue were they minded to again make an example of someone, as appears to have been the case in the Chroin incident. As far as I was aware, the 5 miles is simply a guideline. Personally, I think driving around 100 miles (there and back) or so for an outing is OK. Scots & Welsh, you have my sympathies. (Thanks to my better half for spotting this.). Yes, but these closures are about preventing places getting mobbed and trashed. Anyone thinking that the 5 mile limit was made specifically for climbers and keen hillwalkers must be delusional. > The reasons for the guidance will certainly be relevant. > Michael Matheson, the Transport Minister, is / was a keen hill walker and a member of Ochils MR. Ah, yes, that rings a bell, particularly re the MRT aspect. The bit round the popular western side of Dumyat is semi-chaos. It is all about staying local. The 'no judgement' approach seems slightly less evident on some MR social media posts (for what that's worth) - due to total exasperation. > This leads to a slightly topsy-turvy situation whereby you can only travel outside your local area if it is to meet someone else! > Are we saying now the outdoors is only for people who are experienced? > But then I'm pretty sure that Scottish Golf is being more bullish and robust in its dealings with the Scottish government than is Mountaineering Scotland. And how about the cyclist who crashes her bike 75 miles from home? To go to the Ochils, I have also driven more than 5 miles but it definitely feels local and within the spirit of the guidelines. The decision to bring them to court or not and if so what the final charges will be is for the procurator fiscal not the police. If the intention is to enforce the guidance as law then this needs to be made clear, and not to get too pernickety but it actually needs to be made law. How would you write the rules? Were they hurling rocks down the hill,I doubt it. – Stirling GC is reported to have a waiting list for the first time in years. The Dunblane clubhouse is just over five miles too. That would inevitably limit what they could say in a situation such as this. As anSNP member I was sent acopy of the roadmap last week. Personally I would like people with liver disease, lung cancer or type 2 diabetes to have access to the best care available for their conditions. I think in trying to make my point that there are different points of emphasis people could take from the guidance I went too far in saying you are choosing the bits that suit, apologies for this. Maybe mountaineering Scotland etc promoting mountain safety in hot conditions would be more appropriate than prosecuting the few who make mistakes. After all, we could be rugby players! Someone (not them) has called mountain rescue and they have been found to be fine. > John Swinney drove from Perthshire to Edinburgh to visit his dad on the first day of 'Phase 1'. The essence is doing something that potentially exposes, not actually exposes a person to Covid-19. Life is a carnival! And no mention now of the “within 5 miles”. © UKClimbing Limited. At present I have no idea whether the individuals involved were acting in a culpable and reckless manner. On the the other hand, golf courses are very specific areas whereas the hills and crags are not, so it is possible to imagine they might. After 50 years of hill_going there,s something wrong if you feel you have to keep looking over your shoulder. You must see that, to many average people, that seems like an abuse of process?
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